Curse

Del · Jan 25, 2010, 02:15 AM // 02:15

12 axe/9 strength/9 domination

dismember
body blow
disrupting chop
bull's strike
powerblock
frenzy
rush
res sig

Quality skill bar.

Del · Jan 25, 2010, 02:43 AM // 02:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by Regulus X

NOTE: APATHETIC TOM IS PROHIBITTED FROM POSTING ANYWHERE ON THIS THREAD IF IT HAS ANY TROLL IN IT WHATSOEVER.

I wasn't trolling, just offering a suggestion to help you.

BoxOfCox · Jan 25, 2010, 03:28 AM // 03:28

1. Wear Rune of Clarity and -20% blind shield.
2. Receive Bsurge
3. Count to 4.
4. Press shock.
5. If ele did not spam Bsurge on recharge when you shocked him (2.5% chance in RA), press Dchop as he stands up.
6. ???
7. Profit!

Alternatively, I find Apathetic Tom's suggestion was quite solid as well:

The Drunkard · Jan 25, 2010, 03:38 AM // 03:38

I frequent RA and I have seen very few blindbots recently, most of which are the dual attune eles with blinding flash. I don't think it's that big of a deal but w/e.

Why not just bring back the enchant clause, that way it only punishes the wars stupid enough to bring mending?

Del · Jan 25, 2010, 03:43 AM // 03:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by BoxOfCox

Alternatively, I find Apathetic Tom's suggestion was quite solid as well:

See Regulus, i told you. shit also wrecks monks too.

obsidian ectoplasm · Jan 25, 2010, 06:29 AM // 06:29

B surge is OP. ( 4v4)

Does it urgently need a nerf? No

Aljasha · Jan 25, 2010, 02:10 PM // 14:10

as a warrior take -40% blind reduction runes and shield mod and as a ranger mend condition. problem solved.

Del · Jan 25, 2010, 03:16 PM // 15:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aljasha

as a warrior take -40% blind reduction runes and shield mod and as a ranger mend condition. problem solved.

mending touch? you can't self target with mend condition.

Ariena Najea · Jan 25, 2010, 04:30 PM // 16:30

Hehe, Power Block does seem fun on a Warrior!

Having a Clarity Rune and a -20% Shield does allow Blind to end before BSurge is recast, assuming they don't hit HSR. Most people use it on recharge, so either interrupting or kding works fine. Just remember to have the Shield on before you get hit with BSurge, since you won't reduce the duration of Blind by switching to the shield after it has been applied.

Also, Dom Mesmers wreck BSurge. It's often a good investment to drop a Diversion onto the BSurge Ele, since they are generally so reliable and you save some pressure from your Monk(s), as well as pressure their Monks more than just Diverting even a key skill such as Word of Healing. Also, Power Block =)

Regulus X · Jan 25, 2010, 06:07 PM // 18:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tobi Madera

eh /notsigned.

it gives casters a fighting chance against meele ppl. It keeps blind on them. Learn to live w/ it and fight. Ur a warrior or derv.. learn this fact and flow w/ it.

So does empathy, distortion, Bonetti’s, Insidious Parasite, Blurred Vision, the rest of the Air Magic Line [and I could keep going on & on & on &..] B.Surge’s current recharge and cast time paired with a 40/40 is a recipe for overpoweredness!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Owik Gall

I thought the last nerf was good enough to keep this balanced. It stopped from affecting adjacent foes easily by adding the condition that the foe has to be enchanted. I guess that ain't enough. I suppose that in order to make blinding skills actually balanced in this game the blindness durations would now have to be less than the recharge times. That way it will force the inflicting players to think rather than spam, spam, spam.

They had it that way initially for a reason. It baffles me til this very day as to why they buffed it to stupid 1-1-1-L-O-L-1-L-1-O-1-L-1-proportions. I totally agree on that last sentence. Too bad there’s just too many players using them in 4v4 that don’t care and/or want it to go away because they’re winning way too easily and love it!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Windf0rce

/not signed for all reasons stated above.

Besides, the skill is good, but too specific. Taking Bsurge template (usually an enchant removal, Enervating, etc.) and facing a team of 4 casters / no physicals puts you at a large disadvantage. If you face a team of 3 physicals, you smile... High risk/high reward skill is fine IMHO.

Even versus a caster teams, B.Surgers still deal damage sufficient to help your allies spike them down [unless P.Blocked, in which case.. it really doesn’t matter WHAT caster type you are!].

Quote:

Originally Posted by Apathetic Tom

12 axe/9 strength/9 domination

dismember
body blow
disrupting chop
bull's strike
powerblock
frenzy
rush
res sig

Quality skill bar.

+1 for originality. However, it’s pretty sad how ya’ll support sacking utility for this jaundice. You also have to hope that you catch a B.Surge cast where it’s cast time’s unaffected by the 40/40 set. Otherwise, you’ve just spend 15e failing. I’m not going to say it doesn’t work, but since B.Surge is 3/4ths cast and I don’t use a rupt bot macro, it’s kinda tough to P.Block B.Surge while the chaos ensues [especially without the Fast Cast]. Any lag, or if his 40/40 speeds it up, and you’ve just wasted your time and effort. If you always 100% land P.Block on 3/4th cast spells, then rupt botting comes into mind. Sorry, I just don’t trust any players to be legit. Just my personal opinion, though [not that you should take it to heart].

Quote:

Originally Posted by iTzF3aR

stop whining.

Stop posting [if you can’t post anything relating to the topic that is]!

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Drunkard

I frequent RA and I have seen very few blindbots recently, most of which are the dual attune eles with blinding flash. I don't think it's that big of a deal but w/e.

Why not just bring back the enchant clause, that way it only punishes the wars stupid enough to bring mending?

You’re obviously either just lying? Or you’re just not playing enough Random Arenas to notice them..! Or you’ve just had a stroke of incredibly good luck! If luck is the case, then let me borrow your Rabbits’ Foot! O0

Quote:

Originally Posted by obsidian ectoplasm

B surge is OP. ( 4v4)

Does it urgently need a nerf? No

That’s really all you needed to say. My point has been further validated having read that particular segment.

Windf0rce · Jan 25, 2010, 06:39 PM // 18:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by Regulus X

I’m not going to say it doesn’t work, but since B.Surge is 3/4ths cast and I don’t use a rupt bot macro, it’s kinda tough to P.Block B.Surge while the chaos ensues [especially without the Fast Cast]. Any lag, or if his 40/40 speeds it up, and you’ve just wasted your time and effort. If you always 100% land P.Block on 3/4th cast spells, then rupt botting comes into mind. Sorry, I just don’t trust any players to be legit. Just my personal opinion, though [not that you should take it to heart].

You are terrible if you can't reliably interrupt BSurge or any other 3/4cast spell (Word of Healing comes to mind), even if you can't reflex it, you can eventually predict it and land the rupt.

I've had my WoH D-shotted way more times than I can count by good Rangers out there - note that there's even the arrow flight time here. Saying a non-Mesmer can't run Power Block (or any other 1/4 cast rupt spell) reliably because he lacks Fast Casting is perhaps the biggest joke in this already hilarious thread (or biggest troll of the thread).

3/4casts can be easily Dchopped too, even with a not so optimal ping you should be able to predict it -if you are Blind, predict-Shock it. Or wait until the Blind is almost over (almost time for the Ele to want to renew it), Shock the ele, by the time he gets up and your Blind is gone, you can be certain he will cast Bsurge as soon as he gets up, it is when you Dchop it.

Or yell at your Ranger/Necro/Mesmer to stop being idiots and interrupt/divert/pblock/remove the ele attunes. There are tons of options - if your team has none, you deserve to lose anyway because you lack disruption.

If I started a thread QQ'ing about how much a Dom Mesmer completely OWNS a Monk in RA, everybody would tell me the same - it's fine, your team simply needs to disrupt the Mesmer, because if he is left alone doing his job, the Monk will not do his'/hers. Same applies to Ele x Melee = leave the Ele do his thing, he will wreck your damage (be with Blind, or Water snares).

Del · Jan 25, 2010, 06:47 PM // 18:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by Regulus X

Even versus a caster teams, B.Surgers still deal damage sufficient to help your allies spike them down [unless P.Blocked, in which case.. it really doesn’t matter WHAT caster type you are!].

because people stand still and let an ele with poor damage output slowly kill them?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Regulus X

+1 for originality. However, it’s pretty sad how ya’ll support sacking utility for this jaundice. You also have to hope that you catch a B.Surge cast where it’s cast time’s unaffected by the 40/40 set. Otherwise, you’ve just spend 15e failing. I’m not going to say it doesn’t work, but since B.Surge is 3/4ths cast and I don’t use a rupt bot macro, it’s kinda tough to P.Block B.Surge while the chaos ensues [especially without the Fast Cast]. Any lag, or if his 40/40 speeds it up, and you’ve just wasted your time and effort. If you always 100% land P.Block on 3/4th cast spells, then rupt botting comes into mind. Sorry, I just don’t trust any players to be legit. Just my personal opinion, though [not that you should take it to heart].

if you camp zealous, p block is easy enough to use, and it has greater utility than shock, and you can easily wreck any casting profession with it. and 3/4s is easy enough to rupt if you wait for it, and you can also weapon swap to a 4040 dom set and a +30 set, or +20e staff for extra energy, failing that, hit a slower spell. otherwise, just earn to counter b surge, OR, get your teammates to help you kill the ele, rather than complain about an easy to counter skill.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Regulus X

You’re obviously either just lying? Or you’re just not playing enough Random Arenas to notice them..! Or you’ve just had a stroke of incredibly good luck! If luck is the case, then let me borrow your Rabbits’ Foot! O0

actually, his statement was completely accurate, the sheer mass of air eles i encounter in RA are using mind shock, their dps is still barely decent, but it's a hell of a lot better than a b surge ele.

All in all, i'd say your best bet would be to get good. whining about a skill that you have a problem with isn't really going to solve anything, and the sooner you learn to count to 4 and press shock, the sooner you can actually start to win.

Regulus X · Jan 25, 2010, 06:51 PM // 18:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by Windf0rce

You are terrible if you can't reliably interrupt BSurge or any other 3/4cast spell (Word of Healing comes to mind), even if you can't reflex it, you can eventually predict it and land the rupt.

I've had my WoH D-shotted way more times than I can count by good Rangers out there - note that there's even the arrow flight time here. Saying a non-Mesmer can't run Power Block (or any other 1/4 cast rupt spell) reliably because he lacks Fast Casting is perhaps the biggest joke in this already hilarious thread (or biggest troll of the thread).

3/4casts can be easily Dchopped too, even with a not so optimal ping you should be able to predict it -if you are Blind, predict-Shock it. Or wait until the Blind is almost over (almost time for the Ele to want to renew it), Shock the ele, by the time he gets up and your Blind is gone, you can be certain he will cast Bsurge as soon as he gets up, it is when you Dchop it.

Or yell at your Ranger/Necro/Mesmer to stop being idiots and interrupt/divert/pblock/remove the ele attunes. There are tons of options - if your team has none, you deserve to lose anyway because you lack disruption.

Predicting and shooting at the time you "think" he/she's going to use it eventually converts to a term known as "spamming", and for rangers it's LOL easy to. I get them all the time! Mesmers using P.Block on the other hand are a totally different story. Fast Cast, one chance, one shot; either you land it and win or you miss it [namely due to either lag, their 40/40 set, or unpredictable castings].

(Again) If you can rupt B.Surge reliably 100% of the time as you seem to be claiming, you're either rupt-botting, or have really good connectivity and "luck" because knowing when someone's going to cast something is nearly impossible! What if the caster doesn't cast when you thought he would? It's then called spam; P.Block cannot be spammed! If you're landing rupts on important skills 100% of the time without fail on all key skills/spells? YOU'RE A RUPT BOTTER. When I see Magebane, Savage and D.Shot appear in my damage monitor alot without successfully rupting my skills/spells, I can tell that the ranger's actually playing. Same goes for when they luck out and hit some of my spells. But when I see a ranger rupting all my important skills/spells 100% of the time, that's when I raise the bullshit flag [especially if I see a LOL gold cape on him because GvG & HA are swamped with rupt-botters].

Quote:

Originally Posted by Apathetic Tom

if you camp zealous, p block is easy enough to use, and it has greater utility than shock, and you can easily wreck any casting profession with it. and 3/4s is easy enough to rupt if you wait for it, and you can also weapon swap to a 4040 dom set and a +30 set, or +20e staff for extra energy, failing that, hit a slower spell. otherwise, just earn to counter b surge, OR, get your teammates to help you kill the ele, rather than complain about an easy to counter skill.

I'm going to test out your P.Block War a bit to see how it fairs out. Also, stop labelling me a "whiner" [please] because my arguement is rather solid; I'm not the only one who thinks B.Surge is OPd as you can see in this thread, and even during matches vs. these 1-1-1-1-1'ing [ab]users. Just re-read this thread and see for yourself. You've even admitted it's OP'd in 4v4 along with some others, so it's no secret!

Dabineh Deathbringer · Jan 25, 2010, 07:49 PM // 19:49

/not signed. This skill at first I thought was OP, but that is because I was a melee class. Once I rolled a caster I thought it was way too underpowered. Against a caster class, like windf0rce said, you are at a huge disadvantage with this as your elite.

If you're going to rant about this spell, maybe you should rant about Broad head arrow or anything that gives dazed condition. If used correctly, that shuts down a caster like this spell shuts down a melee.

Skyy High · Jan 25, 2010, 08:01 PM // 20:01

Is it worth pointing out that, save for the enchantment clause on the skill, BSurge is currently the weakest it's ever been? The blind duration has been hit multiple times, and I can't see any history on the wiki of its base stats ever being any worse than it is now. Why are you so on about this skill now, when it's been out for years now in its current (or more powerful) state in 4v4? I don't remember anyone ever complaining about this skill as much as you.

Puebert · Jan 25, 2010, 08:05 PM // 20:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by Regulus X

Neither is EDA [strip all enchants to win], but it didn't stop Anet from nerfing EDA, now did it? B.Surge is just a spell-based form of EDA. B.Surge should be right next to EDA on their nerf-list. Should we jump through a million hoops vs B.Surge as we did for EDA? NO.

EDA is different. It's much harder to rupt and dishes out free blind every two attacks. The amount of blind coming from EDA is bounded only by the speed which you can attack. BSurge is bounded by a mandatory 4 second recharge, and in that time EDA can blind 2 or even 3 people.

MagmaRed · Jan 25, 2010, 08:38 PM // 20:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by BoxOfCox

Alternatively, I find Apathetic Tom's suggestion was quite solid as well:

I won't tell you to run Power Block on a Warrior, but I do find the picture hilarious. The reason it makes a good point is missed by you, and maybe others who haven't posted. It is different. You get shut down by Blinding Surge because you do the same thing over and over, and do not bring a counter, or at least dont' use a counter correctly. As mentioned, there are plenty of ways to deal with the Blind. Try using them until you find one that fits your playstyle best. And if you don't think there are players out there who can reliably interrupt 3/4 cast spells, you don't know much. I can remember playing my Monk in AB, one of the arenas most known for noobs. I am not a PvP Monk though, and I certainly would never claim to be one. I ran a trypical hybrid build with WoH, Guardian, PS, Patient, and Cure. His first interrupt was good timing, as I didn't realize he was there yet, and he hit my Cure Hex with Savage Shot. Not a big deal, only a 1 second cast. But when I used WoH next, I got hit with DShot.... ouch. Went to Patient next, and that is a 1/4 second cast, and got that one cast. BUT, he wasn't done. Even with me moving around to try and make him miss, I got hit casting PS, which is a 1/4 and until his team killed me, I was able to cast only 1 spell. ONLY that one Ranger dealing with arrow flight was interrupting me, no Mesmer around. So it is definitely possible to reliably interrupt a 3/4 cast skill, and if you know the patterns people like to use, as well as the castnig speed and recharges, you can hit 1/4 second casts.

Basically, you need to improve. If blind is pwning you so bad, and you can't find a counter that works, you need to learn how to improve.

Regulus X · Jan 25, 2010, 09:16 PM // 21:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skyy High

Is it worth pointing out that, save for the enchantment clause on the skill, BSurge is currently the weakest it's ever been? The blind duration has been hit multiple times, and I can't see any history on the wiki of its base stats ever being any worse than it is now. Why are you so on about this skill now, when it's been out for years now in its current (or more powerful) state in 4v4? I don't remember anyone ever complaining about this skill as much as you.

And as weak as it is, it's still OP'd because it can keep any melee permanently shut down. As to your "why now" question: RA has seen a huge influx in B.Surge usage. Similar to any OP'd FotM build, players usually just turn to the next best and generally OP'd skill, condition, etc.. to abuse. No one thought LC or Mind Blast Distortion ele's were overpowered namely because either a.) THEY'RE THE ONES LOL [AB]USING THE LOL BUILD THEMSELVES IN LOL PVP while saying shit like, "Qq sum moar scrub! LOLOL" so they LOL OFC SUPPORT IT, or b.) they don't PvP anyways, so "Who gives a shit/Qq Moar Scrub/Just find a counter somewhere, STFU + DEAL WITH IT?" was their motto.

The only ones that griped about it were the ones that got repeatedly lamed and rick-rolled, forcing them to spec. just to specifically counter their "lame" while losing to other more normal, less OP'd teams. It's a lose-lose situation; a catch-22.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Puebert

EDA is different. It's much harder to rupt and dishes out free blind every two attacks. The amount of blind coming from EDA is bounded only by the speed which you can attack. BSurge is bounded by a mandatory 4 second recharge, and in that time EDA can blind 2 or even 3 people.

Enchantment Removal FTW? At least that's what players told me all the time until the more competent players realized it was OP'd; the lame just kept [ab]using OPd builds and disapproving of its nerfage.

MasterSasori · Jan 25, 2010, 09:25 PM // 21:25

B surge is strong in RA. Hexes are even worse.

Mending touch/Antidote signet rangers> B surge ele

Anet removed TA rather than deal with skills that are OP in 4v4.

Your nerf isn't coming. So if I were you, I'd go mesmer/ranger and beat them silly.

Regulus X · Jan 25, 2010, 09:38 PM // 21:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by MasterSasori

B surge is strong in RA. Hexes are even worse.

Mending touch/Antidote signet rangers> B surge ele

Anet removed TA rather than deal with skills that are OP in 4v4.

Your nerf isn't coming. So if I were you, I'd go mesmer/ranger and beat them silly.

B.Surge > All possible condition removals in-game [sacrifices utility and drains warriors' energy pool or takes too long to cast *esp. Antidote Signet.. it takes longer to cast removals than it does to cast B.Surge, and B.Surgers have a 40/40 set to reapply it every 2s almost half the time*]

It shows how much /care they have for their game, doesn't it..

I know, but I just like stating the obvious and lamenting over Anet's apathy while simultaneously being trolled on my thread by 1337ists claiming that P.Block is LOL viable, or that energy-draining condition removals such as P.Touch, M. Touch, etc.. are viable ..and what you're saying is that if you're not a R/Mo with M.Touch, S/D.Shot and Magebane stapled to your bar, or if you're not taking some erroneous elites [like LOL P.Block] just to counter one f*cking spell because it's OBVIOUSLY OVERPOWERED like some of our posters have already implied... YOU'RE @$$3D OUT.